What do you use to connect audio card to mixing desk

Hi everyone!
i have a 100% cantabile only setup, and i was wondering what you experts are using to connect to the mixing desk for live usage:

  1. just direct connection?
  2. use a direct di box? if yes, active or passive and why?
  3. balanced or unbalanced?

In my case we are using a behringer xr18 on stage, so cables length is around 4-6 meters

thanks!

My $0.02USD:

I wouldn’t trust the outputs of the audio card. Most users run in a controlled environment like a home studio and rarely connected/disconnected. A live environment is not so nice.

I would recommend balanced outs if they are available. I have been using a Midas MR12 as my main stage mixer for several years, and I send it to the house PA when needed. I also use an XR12 as my main keyboard mixer (same mixer except for the mic preams). I like that it has XLR outputs (and TRS, if the Aux sends mirror the Mains). I also like that it has EQ and effects, which is sometimes useful for a venue that has both an outdoor and indoor mix. The outputs easily drive 10-15 meters of cable to wherever the house PA lives.

I bought mine in 2018, when prices on Behringer and Midas gear were a good bit lower; I’m not sure if I would go the same route today. But the concept applies.

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My experience:

  • DI box? Yes.
  • Active if powered by the phantom voltage from mixer. If not, passive.
  • Balanced (the DI box is always output-balanced).

I don’t trust battery powered DI boxes. Batteries are fine at home, on stage they’ll be dead by the time the gig starts.

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Is there a reason you are not using the XR18 itself as your audio interface? The only connection between computer and XR18 then would be a USB cable.

Between the XR18 and FOH I would place some form of isolation. I had custom boxes made by Orchid that presents both balanced line and mic feeds to FOH - which they choose is up to them.

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@The_Elf good point: the XR18 is used currently as a band mixer (6-7 elements with many mics, etc) so to simplify things I am using my own card.
Also, we typically use the USB for multitrack recording our live session

@cpaolo thanks for the feedback! when you say

Active if powered by the phantom voltage from mixer

do you have a bad experience with active DIs with their own (good…) power supply?

OK, fair enough.

I wouldn’t use DIs, I would go for a line isolator, for safety reasons, if nothing else. A DI’s job is to drop to mic level. I see no reason to do that in your instance.

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I go from a Focusright 2I4 and its balanced outs via line isolation transformers as suggested above by @The_Elf and this works well.

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Pardon my ignorance, but i was under the impression that a trasformer-based di is in practice the same as an isolator… is it correct or not?

I am a noob in these topics please bear with me :grimacing:

A ‘DI’ produces a mic level output. I see no point in dropping from your mixer’s line output to mic level, unless FOH wants/needs it that way. The hotter the signal you can send to FOH, the less chance there is of interference and noise getting in.

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Here’s the tool for the job:
Orchid Dual Isolator

Hopefully you can get this, or a similar device, wherever you are in the world.

And keep everything balanced as far as possible. Wherever you can use a balanced cable - use one!

ahh ok I get your point. So , following your advice, I have checked the manuals for some DI/isolators and… we get all the possible gains :grinning:

=== DIs
Radial Trim2 (passive DI) : gain=1:1
Radial ProAV2 (passiver DI): gain=i was not able to find it, but it says “mic level output”
Palmer river naab (passive DI): gain=3.16:1
Radial j+4 (active DI): gain= -10…+10db
Palmer river elde (passive DI): gain: 10:1

=== line isolators
Radial SB6 gain= -2db
Palmer river kyII : gain=1:1
Palmer li5 : gain=1.1

so… our mileage will vary a lot… but thanks for highlighting the gain parameter, i had totally overlooked it

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Final thought for you…

There’s nothing stopping you using the XR18 as your audio interface AND the rest of the band plugging into the physical inputs - and recording the whole shebang in Cantabile.

I know, because this is what I do myself!

Thanks! I will keep this in mind, it would simplify a lot for sure

FYI, The Behringer XR (12, 16, 18) prices have come down considerably the last couple of months.

In that case, the XR12 is a great keyboard mixer. In addition to four effects slots, it has 16 virtual channels – useful to send a variation of a keyboard mix to another destination.

IIRC only the XR18 enables multi-track USB record. The other two models are stereo only. Unless anyone knows better?

You are correct. The USB interface on the XR12/XR16 is flash-drive-only support. It can record two simultaneous tracks, each can be taken from the stereo mix, or any of the six Aux sends. The XR18 is the only one that has a true built-in USB audio interface.

If multitrack recording is a priority, the XR12/XR16 are not good choices. The OP asked about live performance use, though, and I still think they are good choices in that situation. In particular, I like the XR12: only 2U of rack space; predominantly TRS I/O (like keyboards tend to have); 16 channels in software; lower cost. But I can see use models where the XR16 would win out.

Thanks for confirming.

The OP said he uses his XR18 to multi-track record their live sessions, hence my raising this feature.

I also bought my XR18, in part, for its multi-track USB capability.