State behaviour total confused

My problem ist I have :

1 Linked Rack with many Lightscenes
in this Rack there are many embeded Racks to control the devices (scanner etc.)

(masterrack >) is it possible to have states with fixed combinations as presets
and maybe in songstate nr.4 to change one item of this preset

Question how can I save a fixed preset in the Masterrack or change it so cantabile know’s this is not only a songstate controlled change???

I am totaly confused

only a simple Example:

i have a Fix-Preset (Nr.1) with one red light …

with state behavior (by songstate) i set this light to green for 1 of 10 songstates

later I will make a change in Template (Nr.1)… maybe the template color should be now blue for all new states

How can I save this in the Rack state? new fixed template (Nr.1)

How can cantabile distinguish if it is a song-controlled-change or a change on my template and how can i store this change???

Hi @Juergen

Not sure I’m completely following the question here, but the option in the screen shot that you’ve highlighted essentially means that the select state of the “OR - Scanner POSITION” rack will be controlled by the selected song/song state. Note that this means all songs and song states will remember the selected state for this embedded rack and reselect it when activated.


Thanks Brad, this is working…
I can control the states from this Rack with my songs that’s right.

But the problem is this ‘LightRack’…
there are many states with complete scenes of my setup

What I do not understand …


  1. I create a new songstate
  2. I choose from the light track an entry
  3. I change e.g. a setting in the rack ‘ScannerGobo’
    everything is saved in the song

how can I change and save the states in the ‘Lightrack’ (regardless of the song) …
e.g. because an attitude is too restless for me and I would like to change it in general?

I thougt if I open a state in my ‘LightRack’ and do a change in one embeded rack I must save this new ‘Lightrack-state’ with Save Rack…
but this has no effect to the rackstate…

everytime I build a new song and choose this ‘changed’ state in my ‘Lightrack’ I have the old values and not the new! …whats wrong here?

so how can i change an existing states values?

my biggest problem is how to save a changed LightrackState

is there a graphic to see how cantabile handles the data management for better understanding…

I dont know if a state (record) is copyed or if it is linked with completely different results when workink (copy/change) with it…

For the next time I will work only with fixed states but the problem is… every change needs a new state and at the end it will be a scrolling orgy.

So it would be much better to take small changes more song-state-specific (but how to do?)

Hi Juergen,

I’m really confused by what you’re asking here. Sometimes it seems like you’re having trouble saving things across all songs:

And other times you want to save things per-song:

Perhaps if you can create a simple example demonstrating the problem and send me the files I can get a better understanding of what the problem is.


Yes…I know it’s tricky

I think ‘Exported State’ is my Problem

I don’t know whats going on with the different combinations of the options…

i will test it first with simple configurations

Try to explain: (simple case)

Song with 3 Songstates
1 Rack with 3 Rackstates ( 1 Plugin inside )

Scene 1 - Preset1
Scene 2 - Preset2
Scene 3 - Preset3

1 - Scene 1 (- Preset1)
2 - Scene 2 (- Preset2)
3 - Scene 3 (- Preset3)

Now I add one new songstate…and choose 2 - Scene 2 (- Preset2)

this Preset should be changed only in this song/ (songstate) so i call Preset 8…

Now I add one more new songstate…and that happens
normaly I thought to have the real Parameter like it is stored in my rack but now it shows the changed parameter from the last Step.

The Idea was to work with the Rackstates like a ‘Template’ but without saving it shows the wrong value…
What’s wrong here…?

Hi @Juergen

I just went through all the steps you’ve described here and as best I can tell it working as designed. When you select the exported state behaviour…


… you’re really this setting is no longer part of the rack’s state - rather it’s set by the parent song. So when you create a new state in the parent song, that setting gets copied from it’s current setting as stored by the song.

ie: When you created “NEW STATE B” the DMXIS Preset 8 got copied from whatever it currently was. I’m guessing you had “NEW STATE A” selected at the time so, preset 8 was attached to that new state.

If you selected “SONGSTATE 2” and then created “NEW STATE B” then it would have got the value “Preset 2”


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Ok…think this is clear now :grinning:

But when not using DMXIS (as Example) and I have a
embedded Rack here… there is one more Option:

(Tested also with all exported state options off)

First State of my Lightshow-Rack - Device (green) set to off

this is stored in (Ambi1) Rackstate1 and locked… problem:

First Song …insert a Songstate (1)…select Ambi1…Result >>off
…insert a Songstate (2)…select Ambi1…>>Result >>off
Set Value to On and store in song

now i go to a new song…

Second Song …insert a Songstate (1)…select Ambi1 Result >>ON ???

Why the (Ambi1) rack value is changed to ON although it is locked???

the Lock is working on a Plugin like DMXIS …but not with an embeded Rack!

The Exported State behaviour controls whether the exported behaviours from the rack are controlled by states on the parent rack/song and/or whether they’re further exported from this song/rack.

  • When this is off, switching states on the parent song won’t affect the exported behaviours of the rack.
  • When this is on, each state in the parent song will have it’s on set of settings for the exported behaviours.
  • When this is set to exported, the exported settings are pushed out one further level to the next parent song/rack.

(I know - it’s a bit of a brain bender)


Thanks @brad

…I think I have found my problem

I didn’t realize that different Songs could have different attitudes in Rack-State Behavior.

So some settings were exported in one Song and then in the next Song again not…

…to go crazy :dizzy_face::ghost::rage::weary::fearful::cold_sweat::grimacing::flushed::crazy_face:

Happy …Now all racks working like expected :sunny: :smiley: :sunny:


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