A recent jamming musician is into The Doors. Their keys sound is distinct. I have the entire DSK library – and it is good – but we couldn’t find a similar sound. What do/would you use?
The same problem exists with the saxophone on Careless Whisper. TIA, – Ron
Are you talking about Ray Manzarek’s electric piano or organ sound? His electric piano is a Rhodes Mark 1, and he probably played it through an amp with a spring reverb. I am pretty sure they recorded at Sunset Sound in L.A. which had a plate reverb too. I have gotten pretty close using Acoustic Samples’ V-Tines using a preset called “San Francisco” custom, then routing it through Voxengo’s free tube amp and a spring reverb from Audiothing called Springs. Ray also used a rare instrument called a Bass Rhodes in place of electric bass.
Now here is the main issue. I have access to a vintage Mark 1 and it always sounds better no matter how much I tweak a VST sound. I think the secret is the mechanical action on the Rhodes, which causes one to play a certain way. An actual Rhodes as a certain feel to it that I’ve never experienced in a MIDI controller, which are usually geared to either feel like a synth or an acoustic piano. In Cantabile, if you fiddle with the velocity curve it will help get your midi controller closer to the correct “feel.”
For the organ sound, he played a Vox Continental. Arturia has one with a couple of Doors presets, and their is an older free vst called Combo Model V which sounds pretty good.
For Careless Whisper, George Michael famously went through a bunch of sax players before finding a local guy that got the sound he wanted. I play sax as my primary instrument and part of the secret is: how he plays the dynamics, some key gliss, and some gentle scooping.
Thanks, Paul, for the great info. I’ll see how far I get with it.
I have a sax that I play once every decade. I’m terrible at it. I devised a fingering method to avoid transposing and memorizing fingerings. Each note gets its tab written below it. It works for me. Here’s the link:
The SWAM saxophones are pretty covincing for faking sax parts on a keyboard - just did a bit of careless whispering using the SWAM alto sax - was fun! Definitely good enough for jamming. Takes a bit of practicing to fake the sax techniques using pedal, aftertouch, wheels and light-touch legato playing, but can be very expressive.
Not exactly cheap, though, but definitely worth it if faking sax parts is a regular requirement. For me it is, and I really enjoy my “fake sax”…
Acousticsamples have excellent Wurly and Rhodes libraries. Their “VTines” Rhodes Mark 1 is my go-to stage Rhodes. Has great feel - not “plasticky” at all.
Martinic built two great-sounding free combo organs (Vox and Farfisa type) years ago - I guess that’s what you refer to. They don’t provide them on their homepage anymore, but the plugs can still be found on the web. I use the Vox regularly - very nice.
Cheers,
Torsten
All great input, thanks. Here’s my version of the sax solo.
Careless Whisper – sax solo
piano:
F4 ||: E5 D5 A4 F4 E5 D5 A4 F4 | C5 B4 F4 D4 C5 Bb4 F4 | Bb4 A4 F4 D4 Bb3 | A3 Bb3 C4 D4 E4 F4 G4 A4 :|| D4
alto sax:
D ||: C# B F# D C# B F# D | A G D B A G D | G F# D B G | F# G A B C# D E F# :|| B
alto sax (Ron’s tabs):
‘6 ||: ‘00 ‘1 ‘3% ‘6 ‘00 ‘1 ‘3% ‘6 | ‘2 ‘3’ 6 1 ‘2 ‘3 ‘6 | ‘3 ‘3% ‘6 1 3 | 3% 3 2 1 00 ‘6 ‘5 ‘3% :|| >6v
guitar chords:
Dm7 Gm7 Am7 Bbmaj7 Dm
The Doors used a Rhodes bass keyboard for bass lines (sometimes doubled by a string bass on the recordings) - up to you whether it sounds any different from a plain old Rhodes to you. Plugin emulations:
There is also this free keyboard bass, but it’s not the Rhodes:
I believe the Careless Whisper solo was done on Tenor, not alto. The legend is that the tape was slowed down and it was played a half step lower, then sped back up again, which is why it kind of sound like an alto.
Interesting, although it’s not obvious what that technique – slow / normal tape speed – would achieve. I had heard that the harpsichord sound on the Beatles’ In My Life was George Martin on piano recording at slow speed, then it was played back sped up.
The formatting will require downloading:
In My Life (solo) (‘ = 1/32nd of a measure, where a measure = 32 tics) (every fret number = 1 tic) (a triplet = 4 tics, not 6)
IX XII
1 ||’’’’------9’’’-----12’\10’/12’--------------|’’’’---------------------’’’’-----12’’’15’’’|
2 ||----10’12’----10’’’–’’—’’–12’’’9’’’12’’’|-------9’10’’’14’\12’/14’----15’’’----------|
3 ||●-------------------------------------------|----11’---------’’—’’---------------------|
4 ||●-------------------------------------------|--------------------------------------------|
5 ||--------------------------------------------|--------------------------------------------|
6 ||--------------------------------------------|--------------------------------------------|
1 ’’14’12’14’—14’—14’-----13’\12’/13’----------|
2 -----------15’—14’—12’’’–’’—’’–15’’’12’’’|
3 -------------------------------------------------|
4 -------------------------------------------------|
5 -------------------------------------------------|
6 -------------------------------------------------|
|1.IX |2.IX VI ||
1 ’’12’10’12’9’12’—12’-----12’\10’/12’9’’’—’’|’’12’9’/10’/12’9’--------------------’’’’||
2 ----------------12’—10’’’–’’—’’------12’–|------’’—’’----10’–9’10’’’97----------||
3 ----------------------------------------------●|--------------------9’---------976-------||
4 ----------------------------------------------●|----------------------------------97’----||
5 -----------------------------------------------|-----------------------------------------||
6 -----------------------------------------------|-----------------------------------------||
In My Life (II = index finger on 2nd fret, I = index finger on 1st fret, \ = slur down, / = slur up)
II I
1 ||’’’’--------------------------------|’’’’----------------’’’’----0’’’3’’’|
2 ||--------2’’’----5’\3’/5’------------|------------2’\0’/2’----3’’’--------|
3 ||●—2’4’----2’’’-’’–’’-4’’’1’’’4’’’|------1’2’’’-’’–’’-----------------|
4 ||●-----------------------------------|----4’------------------------------|
5 ||------------------------------------|------------------------------------|
6 ||------------------------------------|------------------------------------|
1 ’’2’0’2’–2’–2’----1’\0’/1’--------|
2 --------3’–2’–0’’’-’’–’’-3’’’0’’’|
3 ------------------------------------|
4 ------------------------------------|
5 ------------------------------------|
6 ------------------------------------|
|1. II |2. ||
1 ’’0’–0’–0’–0’------------------’’|’’0’-----/0’--------------------’’’’||
2 ----3’–2’–0’------5’\3’/5’2’’’0’–|----2’/3’/–2’----------------------||
3 ----------------2’’’-’’–’’--------●|-----’’–’’—2’–1’2’’’1’----------||
4 -----------------------------------●|----------------2’--------420-------||
5 ------------------------------------|-----------------------------420----||
6 ------------------------------------|------------------------------------||
Supposedly, he was having trouble hitting the high F sharp.
Ah, got it!
This has got to be immoral, illegal, or at least just tsk. A friend wanted to play Soul Kitchen by The Doors. The chord sound was isolated in Audacity, exported as a .wav file, and loaded into Cantabile. Wow!