Help With 2 Problems

If anyone can give a little insight, I would be most appreciative.

In a gig about 2-3 months ago, my controllers self-transposed a half step down. I rarely use transpose, but I was in C, and controllers went into B. I rebooted controllers, cycled C3 engine off and on. I also re-started my audio interface. The only thing that worked was rebooting laptop. I discussed this earlier in the forum (somewhere), but could not recreate the problem since.

I had the same thing happen at last nights gig in the middle of the last set. Since we start songs immediately after the end of the previous, all I could do was quickly pull up an amp sim, and finish out on guitar. (no transpose problem there of course). I searched the forum when I got in, and noticed a transpose problem in 3613, which is what I’ve been running. Hopefully, 3615 will cure the problem. I normally do not change anything while I am constantly gigging, but at tonight’s gig, I will be wincing in 3615. :sweat_smile:

Last night also presented a new problem. One of my long time, stable racks changed itself. It was showing signal…but no output. The rack and songs, have never failed before.

I noticed my output in song view magically disappeared with every song the rack was in. I had to unlock song states, and add output to every state. I haven’t made any changes in the rack or songs. In fact, the songs and rack worked perfectly last weekend, and rehearsals this week.


Any ideas are very welcome. The gig was totally packed, SRO. It was very embarrassing and stressful. We rocked thru it anyway. :sunglasses:


I don’t have any ideas for the other problem, but there was a transpose issue in 3513 that was fixed in 3515.

  • Paul
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hey Corky,

Are you using the class compliant driver or a driver from the manufacturer for your MIDI controllers? I just wonder if it might be the windows compliant driver because you said “controllers” so I assumed you went plug and play. Just a thought …

Not sure what going on with problem #2 but if I think of something I’ll post …



Hey Dave

I think I may be using the class compliant driver. I am setting up for gig right now, and will check the drivers when my laptop is ready to go. You assumed correctly, I went plug and play. Will have to download Manufacturer drivers…if they exist. Good call on that.

update: Yep, no manufacturer drivers listed on laptop. Will have to install them tomorrow. Thanks.

What did the final Output port route look like before it went away @Corky, just curious? Also what C3 updates were done between the having and not having situation?


Hi Corky,

It might be too early on Monday morning for me, but I’m not really following this. What do you mean by “add output to every state”. Are you saying a routing disappeared in the song files, or do you just mean there was no output signal (audio), something else? Not sure what I’m supposed to be looking at in those screen shots.



This is really bizarre! Today, my wife and I were going to practice for an upcoming performance (she, on Trumpet; me, on EWI (using SampleModelng’s Trumpet software in Cantabile 3 - build 3615). I started to play and found myself in the wrong key!

To simplify things, I leave my EWI controller set to No Transposition © and transpose (per instrument used) the necessary amount in Cantabile. When Using the Trumpet, I transpose -2 at the Incoming MIDI Port for the EWI. Today, when the transpose was set as I normally would (-2), I was playing a whole step down reading the Trumpet sheet music! Somewhere, the MIDI notes were transposed down, but I couldn’t find it anywhere. I was using a Rack (for the Trumpet/Kontakt Player 5) that I created last year and a Media Player to play the rehearsal tracks. I’m not sure what the build was last year, but I am on 3615 today.

I checked a different Song set up the same way (created in August of this year) using the same software from SampleModeling and Kontakt Player 5 and I have the input from the EWI set to transpose -2. This Song works as it should.

I was going to research this some more tomorrow, but when I read your original post again, I thought I should post this dilemma.



That rack was created probably 2-3 years ago, so I don’t really know except to say it was possibly a 35XX update (or 32XX). The final output port within rack was output port - rack stereo out, and the output port at song level was stereo out - output port main speakers.

Hey Brad

The output route disappeared at song level. The 1st example showed the inside of the rack and it’s routing. The 2nd example showed “Add Route”…in other words, the routing disappeared at the song level. When I pulled the song up for play, I had no sound, but all meters were showing sound, except for the output route meter. My main keyboard had sound, the secondary keyboard is where the VB3 rack was routed, no sound.
I was in the middle of a set, so I kept going until break. That was when I discovered the problem was the same in every song containing this particular rack. All my song states are locked, and I’ve used this rack in many songs with no problems, for at least 2 years.
As far as the “output to every state”, during break, I tried to fix upcoming songs containing this rack, I had to go to every song state and add the main speakers routing. I have been on 3613 for a little while, and didn’t chance an update due to a long string of upcoming gigs.
As usual, the guitar player gave me grief about using a computer. He came very close to having a Fender enema. :grin:

Wow Doug! I started playing a song in C, and it was sounding out of tune. My feeble mind was saying “I must have forgotten this song, but my fingers knew the patterns”. I have no songs with this particular band that are transposed, because there is no need. I realized I was playing in B, but fingers were playing in C. In my case, every song left in the gig was also transposed -1. I finished out on guitar, and left the keyboards alone. Hopefully 3615 will cure it, although you are running 3615. Bummer :tired_face:

Hi @Corky,

Regarding the transposition the most critical thing to check is if Cantabile is receiving the wrong notes in the first place. The best way to check this is to go to Options -> Diagnostics and turn on Console Logger and Log MIDI In Events. Play a note and check the console window to see what note is logged. If it’s wrong in the log, then the problem is external to Cantabile. If it’s right, then I’ll need to look into it.

You said the problem was corrected after restarting Windows. Before that, did you happen to also try it after restarting just Cantabile?

As for the missing routes… this is very strange. Cantabile never delete routes unless you explicitly delete them or you delete the target object of a route. If there’s something wrong with the rack such that the routes no longer make sense (eg: different port name) the route will stay there, but be disabled/greyed. Also, the route you’re describing is part of the song, not the rack so changes in the rack should never affect that route.

That said, stranger things have happened and I’d like to figure out exactly what’s going on here but need to understand exactly what happened. Did these routes disappear after updating to a newer build, or just out of the blue?


This happened Friday night. I updated to 3613 in sometime September, and I’ve performed many times, with the same songs since I updated. I fixed the routing in all the songs containing the rack before gig on Saturday, and it held routing. I would say this was out of the blue as I gigged the weekend before with no problem. I am planning to test my setups before my gigs start again Thursday. Would it be better for me to stay in 3613 for testing? I plan to go to 3615 before next gig.

Gotcha. I will do the logger.

This happened a few month ago, as well as Friday. The first time, in order, I rebooted controllers, recycled C3 engine, rebooted interface, no change so exited C3. C3 restart did not solve the problem, so I rebooted computer, got keys back to normal.
Friday, I went thru the same process, except I didn’t reboot computer, as I was too near end of gig to reboot computer…just used amp sim for guitar to finish. Funny thing is, I played for over 3 hrs before it jumped -1. All the songs after the jump were -1. None of my songs used transposition. C3 transposition box showed 0 transposition.

3615 should be safe.

If restarting Cantabile didn’t fix it, but Windows reboot did then that suggests something external to Cantabile.

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