MIDI footswitch for guitar plugin - Two-way communication possible?

I’m looking to transition from a Line6 Helix to using Cantabile with guitar plugins live. So in doing that, I need a foot controller for controlling guitar plugins (primarily Helix Native).

I’m sure I can find any number of foot controllers that will let me send messages to Cantabile, but does anyone know if two-way communication is possible, and what devices support it?

With a regular MIDI footswitch, the switch controller will have no idea what the state of the plugin is, so any status lights and LED displays will quickly get out of sync with the plugin and with Cantabile. So is it possible for Cantabile to send messages about all state changes to an external controller, and if so does anyone know of a MIDI footswitch that will support it?

I need 8-10 fully programmable switches (at the very least I need to be able to send any CC from any switch). Momentary switch support would be really nice to have as well.

Thanks for any and all assistance. I’m somewhat familiar with MIDI and pedal controllers, the communication between physical and virtual stuff is still a bit of a mystery.

Take a look at the EurekaPROM for Behringer FCB1010. In simple I/O mode it transmits CC messages for every button and pedal, as well as send CC messages to turn on and off the LEDs.

Additionally, check out this Cantabile thread:

https://community.cantabilesoftware.com/t/behringer-fcb1010-improved-rom/

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I use a Morningstar MC8 (alongside my Helix).

Morningstar MC8

This is a powerful MIDI control pedal station, with USB, ‘normal’ DIN MIDI ports and ‘omniports’, to which you can add MIDI, switch, or continuous control pedals. Personally I use the omni ports for additional control pedals. Each switch can send up to 16 MIDI messages. You can allocate messages to press, release, hold, double-press, etc. It will power from USB, or from a 9V PSU.

Setting up the MC8 can be a bit mind-bending, depending on how sophisticated you want to get, but the editor software does a good job of helping.

There’s one slight catch in your scenario… The pedals don’t respond one-to-one to the same commands they are set to send, So to set an MC8 switch ‘on’, for example, there’s a specific message required. This has to be handled in Cantabile. As long as you are aware of this, and can create the conversions, then all is well. I found it a bit tough at first, but once I had some examples down I got it all working fine and I can keep Cantabile and my MC8 in sync. When looping, for example, I have the ‘record’ switch flash its screen label while recording is taking place.

With a bit of planning I see no reason why you couldn’t create a ‘pseudo-Helix’, with Helix Native running inside Cantabile and the MC8 exposing the controls. That way you could just port your current Helix presets from the hardware to the software and save a lot of conversion work. I keep my Helix, Stomp XL and Helix Native in step this way.

Morningstar do other models with fewer switches, and the colour MC6 ‘Pro’. All of them are well worth a look. Not cheap, but definitely something I’d re-buy in a heartbeat.

(P.S. Add a CME WIDI Bud Pro and CME Master and you’d be wireless too)

If you could give us more specifics as to what exactly you want to see and why, that might help. I think most of us use song states to set various plugin states, or rack states. Then you’ll always see which state you’re in.
I’m guessing you’re a guitar player like me, and you’re used to a ton of pedals or of course the Helix. But there’s an easier way using Song States. Every single parameter is saved in each song state. Set it to what you need, save and lock it, then do the next song part.

You can name the states like " Heavy Drive with verb" or whatever so you know what it is, which works well for simple songs with just 2-3 states and you’re going back and forth throughout the song. But I usually just build the song sequentially and advance to the next as needed. So song states like "Verse 1, “Chorus 1”, “Bridge”, etc and just step through the song sequentially. (Another button goes to Previous State just in case).
So only one button to worry about (mine has Orange tape on that button so it’s really easy). Torsten, Dave Dore and many others have a lot of great ideas like this.

Like Dluther I use an FCB 1010 but with the stock chip, although I use it the same way he does, just send CC messages and PGM messages. However sometimes you need to see where the Expression pedal is at, or whatever, so yes you need visual feedback. There are all sorts of ways Cantabile can give you visual feedback. One way is to save your Rack State(s) for the plugin so that the plug editor is open to the view you want. So whenever that rack state is used in a song you’ll see the plugin view.
OR save the song or rack state to what you want and add a Show note and you’ll know where you are.

Another very simple way is to create a binding for a particular view… i.e. when I change from Rhythm guitar to Lead, but I need to stay on that Song state, I have the onboard keyboard pop up on the bottom of my screen so I instantly know I’m in Lead mode. So one button on FCB1010 sends a CC message to a Song-level binding to toggle the 2 song states (Song level is not BG rack, so it will toggle only on that song.) Then I add another binding for the same CC, select View then onscreen keyboard then toggle. Set it so it’s visible while in Lead mode and lock the state there. Toggle, check Rhythm so keyboard is gone, lock state. Done.

A third way is even better, using the custom buttons to indicate settings such as gain in db, reverb, or whatever you want to monitor from your plug. That’s a little trickier to get to work, but once you understand it’s quite good. Try the Custom Button section of the guide, or read this thread which is a little more complex but is similar: How to display current note or octave in a controller bar button?

BTW, there are several foot controllers folks use here, so search for that. Personally I’ve used FCB1010 for years, maybe 10 or more, and now have 3 for the various locations I’m playing at. It’s big, a bit heavy, but it’s a tank and has never given me a problem. And look into WIDI bluetooth midi, for no more midi cables. I think there are some other brands now doing inexpensive wireless midi too.

Best of luck!
Tom

Interesting Topic! I’m in the “same boat”. I’m using cantabile with Helix Native since a few weeks and try to get the best out of it.

Recently I bought a “Pirate MIDI Bridge 6” MIDI Controller (similar to the Morningstar MIDI controllers). This controller can receive MIDI messages from other sources like changing the color of the footswitch LED. Maybe this is something you are looking for!?

It’s funny, I was thinking the same thing and decided to roll my own midi controller.

I had posted that here, but thought it might be useful to the general community, not just the guitar players.

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